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Messages - Velleity

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Artisan / Re: How to tell if I'm an Artisan?
« on: May 30, 2011, 09:29:13 PM »
Yeah, I do wonder what the general make-up of art schools is, Michael Teachings wise? Or it might be a soul-age thing... ?  As I got the impression that others didn't think the system was that weird or hard to deal with. Hmm. I really liked art school my first year when I wasn't required to participate in extra curriculars. It was great! Because I was creating art and was allowed to explore. But then things got too serious and I was going to be 'made' to apply to art residencies and grad schools where I was, even though I knew I was going to move out of the country... I'm sure some people can let others' expectations roll off their backs, or not worry as much about it.

Another thing I think is that there was a mis-timing of being expected to have definite personal themes and ideas all ready to be put into artwork, when I was still exploring my self and my artistic voice/soul. Some people already had stuff to say. But I got really lost and felt like things were being yanked out of me before they were ready... (like tearing into a flower bud).

Anyway. I'm glad I went, and I learned an awful awful lot... but I wouldn't go back. heh.

Artisan / Re: How to tell if I'm an Artisan?
« on: May 30, 2011, 05:43:13 AM »
The rules of Art School. Hmm.

From my experience (in two schools), there was a lot of emphasis on social obligations, extroversion, being part of an art community, helping out with things not related to you and your work. And especially with printmaking... well printmakers are a certain kind of breed with a 'guild' mentality. Undergraduates feel obligated ("are expected") to help graduates with projects, graduates help teachers with their projects. Being a king the hierarchy didn't vibe well with me. lol. Which is amusing in retrospect, but I'm not very good at groveling and being in 'awe' of higher ups.

Basically you can't really go to art school and expect to "just make art", unless you want to be seen as a hermit who's not going to make it in the art world. I don't necessarily want to make it in the art world, that's not what I went to art school for, so all the extra networking and social requirements just gave me a huge headache and depressed me. And there didn't seem to be an 'opt out' button. It was looked down upon if you didn't participate. Like extra-curriculars in high school. There are some students who love them, and some who just do not do them. People who do extra-curriculars often don't understand the ones who don't.

I had problems pretending to go along with the system. Maybe artisans are better at faking that they're working or following rules (even if they really aren't). My bf usually did "just enough" to satisfy the instructors then disappeared. And so they usually left him alone. Whereas I felt more rebellious and stubborn in wanting to do things "My Way", and was a bit more in the spotlight of going against the current, even if quietly. Bucking the system entirely, accidentally, rather than playing it to my own advantage. I'm horrible at politics. And I'm too honest and above board when asked "why" about things.

I don't know, for me I'm also just used to having my own agenda and being left alone until I have to hand stuff in. Am used to people trusting that I'll get things accomplished in my own way. Basically I like doing what I want and will finish on the deadline, but I don't like people telling me how to do it, or requiring me do other miscellaneous tasks which in my mind don't "fit" into what I'm doing. I get so focused on a project that when I have to do something, say, help install an installation or do gallery things that I don't have energy for... it just throws me off. If it's part of what I'm doing, then fine.

Not that art people really told me how I must do things, but I guess I'm fond of getting the basic guidelines then being set free. I'm sure artisans and sages are like that as well, and I do know that quite a few other people in my classes struggled with similar things and "how much work is enough work? what am I being judged on exactly? Why does this other person get A's by just doing the paperwork while I get C's and do better art but hate workbooks?". Quite a few friends I made had such great art pieces that the do-gooders didn't understand, and then my friends got C's or barely passed classes because they didn't do all of what was required, or something else dumb. So then we all feel like failures. Makes me angry. My sage sister (who's studying jazz singing) said she doesn't understand how I could survive art school with putting so MUCH of my self and emotions ideas into HUGE long term projects that were graded/judged by others who weren't inclined to really understand me at all (and well, I nearly didn't survive).

Mature King, goes into art school, learns the hard way of what is expected... finds it 'not in line' with her values, then wants to change the system and is angry that people won't allow her to do certain things in a more manageable (for her) way. I still have a lot of angst about it that I'm having to work on.

I don't really understand how one can really get a degree in 'art'... it feels really anathema to the whole creative process. Doesn't treat it very gently, and is geared more toward the art world and art 'business'. Art school is not for artists anymore.

Artisan / Re: Artisan and the Five Levels of Input
« on: May 29, 2011, 11:02:23 PM »
Interesting jk, :) I think where we might differ then is that I don't usually have 'multiple unfinished projects'... ? I don't really like starting something and then not finishing it. :) If I start it, I will return to it. Or I'll "try it out" to see if I would want to put in the effort to continue. Sort of like sampling, but usually when I get an idea I really go with it. It pains me to have to leave things I've put effort into. I like getting something to that 80-90% line before I feel comfortable leaving it.

I really like the television screen metaphor for inputs though. As I think possibly the one-input can look like five-inputs, but only superficially. Or at least, King seems strange to me because it is one-input but has a cardinal outlook, so it's like being able to look out on the scene, the overview, and see all the parts All At Once, the bigger idea/theme and how parts fit together into it. Like sitting back in front of a gallery of paintings. You're focused, yet you can see all the paintings and can zoom into explore all the nooks and crannies of them while still realizing they're part of something 'bigger' (a wall space). Maybe it's kind of like Artisan turned inside out, as I can see a bit why king is said to be the opposite of that role... like, king has a 'theme' and sees all the parts, and artisan might have multiple themes/projects but still has to find out all the parts of them (i.e., they're "out there")? I don't know. All interesting though.

Artisan / Re: Artisan and the Five Levels of Input
« on: May 29, 2011, 02:30:08 AM »
mAmbessa, I think that's why I had trouble at art school, having to do 'a project' over an entire semester!

When I get an idea and then start on the output of it, yeah, I do really tend to work on it all in one go. I take breaks for food and water and some sleep etc. but it would feel very strange to 'start something else' or something that's 'quite different' before I'm relatively done with the other thing ('relatively' meaning 80-90% done). In art school I was used to working 7 hours straight on something and not feeling too tired.

I wouldn't tell it to any of my art instructors, but for months or weeks I'd sit around just thinking about things and ideas, themes, letting things gestate inside or come to something substantial, then I would churn it all out in a few days before it was due. This didn't work very well when I was depressed or when I lacked ideas, but with my output people thought I had "done a lot over that two week holiday!" when really I'd done it all the night before. ;-P

I never told them how I worked, because I was afraid that they would tell me, "with that kind of output think what you could DO with a few months!", me thinking "sure, I could muralize the entire art building but by the end I'd probably have to be hospitalized".

King making art (for me) = "bursts of bulk quality work".

Another grade school teacher noticed it too, when I kept finishing early on certain things and there would be 'a lot' done, and a lot 'very well' done. Said to me "Your work is wonderful! But I'm not quite sure if I like that you work this way... "

Hi There. :)

I'm a king as well and can also relate to quite a few things you mentioned, especially these:

i have a great ability to notice: creativity, quality and originality
i can't stand disrespect
I can also sense and see what plagues a person or what demon they are battling
I have a desire of mastering everything i touch
I feel like people constantly rebel against me, but my kingdom is not one of unprovoked force and persuasion
when i serve, I feel like a king serving through example to bring others up to my kingdom
Gentle Authority/A powerful gentleness

You might find 'lessons of the roles' interesting for king (it's at the very bottom):

That description is what really got me (as a king).
Had been disconnected from essence for quite a few years, but now am starting to come around again. And your 'sensing what plagues a person' reminded me of it, as that started happening to me in my teens (more consciously) after I had gone through some of my own dark stuff. Suddenly started really seeing peoples' "stuff", as if through osmosis, or something kinesthetic. Mostly strong feelings, and then just 'knowing' somehow.

I've noticed criminals are much more likeley to accept advice after you have broken them down to a submissive level.

I used to do this often with our dogs and kids I babysat (not exactly criminals, but you'd be surprised sometimes!), and not in an overly harsh way, but some people under one's care just need a little stubborn nudging and "No"-ness, otherwise it's utter chaos. And afterward I've noticed a big difference in respect, or that they actually like me and want me to come back soon and I can get them to do things (like being creative, drawing) that their parents can't get them to do or never see them doing.

Wonder if Mary Poppins was a king. ;) 

I am ashamed to say that I do not have a lot of training in matters of personality and soul types, etc. But I would like to learn and grow in it.

This is great! Not many people at all have training let alone interest in personality and soul types, or so I've seen of a general populace in my life. It's always a bit strange to bring up in conversation. I think you've come to the right place though, and it's good to have you here.  :)

Soul Age / Re: 6th level mature
« on: May 26, 2011, 11:19:14 PM »
Just be YOU. That's good enough.

Yep, that's one of the big things I'm working on actually.  :-\ ... Perhaps arrogance set in very early then, as that was a main yet subtle message I was given throughout childhood (i.e. talented but not 'good enough' in other ways). 

Anyway.  I don't see my 'stuff' as a burden really (or at least anymore), and I've relatively gotten over most of 'what my peers are doing that I'm not doing' thinking. I was more stuck on that for a while when I was more mired in. But the comparisons made here were more in light of 6th mature, maybe it came off as too whiny but it wasn't meant to be that way.

Soul Age / Re: 6th level mature
« on: May 26, 2011, 10:43:50 PM »
I've never been able to go through typical life stages like other people or follow through

Ah, I see. I'm actually in a similar boat in that regard. Or at least, I feel my life turned quite different from my peers once I hit 20... I had a breakdown, don't have a career (barely have a degree, I hated getting one), don't have a job (have never really had a steady one), am in psychotherapy having had to deal with personal issues that others I know don't seem to have to 'deal' with. Or yeah, I got thrown off the rails and didn't progress 'normally' (or what is normal for the u.s., I shudder to think!).

But I hope that I'm changing inside and working off karma, so this life will be overall a plus

I hope so too. :) Is yours more general karma (from the world and people) or do you have a lot of self-karma as well? Mine seems to be mostly self-karma.

Soul Age / Re: 6th level mature
« on: May 26, 2011, 09:01:48 AM »
I've had people tell me that mine is one of the worst/most difficult lives they've ever heard of

Really? Sorry to hear that Drury. It does put some things in karmic perspective though, with regards to how some people just seem to suffer more than others or keep getting things thrown at them from life. I had always wondered that.  :-\ 

I'm sure people would say I have a pretty easy life, except that I have 'trials', and am 'working things out'.

so I don't feel like I've lost the only-one-lifetime lottery

I know, I'm not sure sometimes how people live with thinking that this is the only life they'll ever get...

And thanks Nancy. :) Maybe it's the tail-end of 6th mature where the 'need to convalesce' starts coming in.

Warrior / Re: Mature/old Warriors
« on: May 25, 2011, 08:47:28 AM »
'Pugnacious' is a good word, like Chiara mentioned. My art tutor whom I spoke of is quite a good stereotype (he might be young or mature), but he was always on the move, had a way of being very blustery, challenged things, liked arguing points for the sake of arguing ('debating', I guess), was very blunt, opinionated, but quite protective and soft with his small son. Some people were scared/frustrated to approach him because of his conversational style, he also came across as quite rough and just really assertive, sometimes narrow minded. Didn't take crap (even if it wasn't crap) and would tell you things very directly. 'Tough', basically. Fighting. Physical. Unafraid, embroiled in situations.

I think my bf's aunt has quite a bit of warrior-like influence to her as well, and she's quite blunt and opinionated, takes up a lot of energetic space and likes to intimidate others in an amusing way to see how they handle themselves (I 'passed the test', pretty easily), but at heart she's quite vulnerable, softer and emotional.

Stereotype seems to be pretty much all the negative warrior traits: Blunt, Brutal, Bullying, Coercive, Devious, Evasive, Explosive, Hot-tempered, Intimidating, Narrow-minded, Pushy, Seeks Conflict, Stressed, Suspicious, Unforgiving, Violent

Priest / Re: Goading
« on: May 25, 2011, 03:59:33 AM »
I can get where you're coming from Daniel.

Maybe it's Priest maya that you "must being inspiring!" just as it's King maya to think "I must lead everything" or "must make the decisions". I often don't feel like being in charge of things, except for what I'm doing personally. The question I hate most these days is when people turn their heads to me and say "so what's for dinner!"..... noooooooo. lol.

It's still nice to be 'available' in some sense, for others, but not too caught up (like you said), usually I like acting as priesty/therapist or sounding board which I don't mind at all, gives me a break from my king-self... 

Warrior / Mature/old Warriors
« on: May 23, 2011, 09:00:04 PM »
What might this look like?

I think one of my best friend from university might be a warrior, or at least could have some warrior aspect to her. I was first surprised when trying to guess her role/cast, as warrior was the one that was superbly fitting but I wouldn't have guessed it of her outright if I had just looked at the stereotypes, and because some warriors I think still rub me in the wrong ways. But I get along with her really well, and she was the first solid friend I made once out of high school. One of those "I know you" resonances, as if we had be friends many times before.

It's like, I'm obviously not the stereotype of a king (young king), so it makes sense that she could also be a bit of a softer warrior, but she still has that fighting spirit in her somewhere, and also likes 'attacking' people, like a small animal. Sometimes I think it can all look a little priesty, but ultimately she just wants to get things done, really likes challenges, and is very good at trouble shooting and being a little soldier on the move. Definitely has both elements of exploration and conquest. When I lived by her she was my small buffer to the world, in that she often drove us places and helped me with daily mundane activities. Got us out of the house and 'to' places.  

She's not incredibly forceful, but can be persuasive. She has a lot of the positive warrior traits in any case: Deliberate, Energetic, Determined, Focused, Grounded, Loves Challenges, Maternal, Nurturing, Organized, Principled, Productive, Protective, Proud, Resourceful, Skillful, Survivor.

That's her in a nutshell! She was also my friend who "didn't procrastinate". (very disciplined) heh.
She also relates a LOT to Lola from Run Lola Run, which is a very warrior-esque film...

But, I guess what I'm trying to say is that I don't find her too scary/intimidating, as is the stereotype for some warriors. She's like an old responsible spitfire grandma who's an absolute hoot and who probably would take you down in a 'rumble'. And it makes me wonder also how many other warriors I've known and liked... probably quite a few...

Generally I feel warriors and myself are on the same page, in terms of getting down to the pertinent information in a quicker fashion. An art tutor I had was very obviously a warrior and no one liked talking to him about their art because he was very blunt and said things straight out. But I loved it because I could 'brief' him about what was going on and then he would be satisfied and would leave me alone to do my things (he was always on the move). Our art talks never took more than 5 minutes, really. heh. Found it much easier to satisfy him because I could just tell him what he wanted to know. Other tutors I felt like I'd have to go on and on about the nuances of my project until they'd go away.

Anyway. What are your experiences of older warriors?

Task Companions / Re: Task Companions
« on: May 22, 2011, 09:45:34 PM »
Oh yeah, I've also done quite a few art pieces that were based off of dreams, and they all turned out really well and art-people didn't know where I came up with the ideas, "I've never seen something like that before". :P ;) So yes, thanks discarnate artisan essence twin! It's amazing to realize what a rich resource dreams are, mine are much more artisan-y than my daily art-thinking, I probably don't often take advantage of them as much as I should.

Do other people seem to feel their task companion through dreams, if discarnate? My 'support' (ET/task c's etc) are not here, so it feels like I got an extra heap (of artisan-ness), along with an intense imagination (and very rich dreamworld).

Task Companions / Re: Task Companions
« on: May 21, 2011, 11:46:50 PM »
I've wondered this too. My task companion is a discarnate artisan (as is my essence twin), and so far in my life I've been drawn to artsy people and creative areas, so I wonder if artisans in general feel more supportive to me, having a surrogate effect on the physical plane of my astral artisan energies. I haven't really known my 'spirit guides', but my dreams are pretty artisan-like, chock full of multi-faceted and inventive symbols. Very colorful as well and like miniature films.

My life-task and other things also suggest that my artisans are pretty influential with those areas. i.e. Art and creating makes me very happy/fulfilled, and is used a lot in my life task.

Priest / Re: Goading
« on: May 21, 2011, 11:21:35 PM »
I think he was both Chiara. Or at least I could have a fun time with him and talk about a lot of things, we also had a lot of cardinal energy that added up (which was intense), but then he had the power-tripping side where he couldn't understand certain fundamental things about me and he felt I was lying when I would try to explain myself, told me plainly that he was right and I was wrong. Interesting fellow, quite magnetic, but in the end didn't feel like dealing with him... but also yes, I think it was difficult being around a person like that at a time when I was more vulnerable and depressed and generally at a weird point in my life. Felt like too much was being ripped off at one time, which is not usually fun for a king who doesn't like feeling her defenses stripped. heh.

But I have come across priests who are much more inspiring/lovely to be around, it's rather infectious. Had a very long chat with one about more fundamental meaningful self things and it felt fairly transcendental and I felt very glowing and happy/fulfilled afterward. Helped that we were sitting in an afternoon sun-bathed room and the light was coming from behind him. lol. His only 'zeal' I saw was when he got onto topics of conspiracy theories... which I could brush aside more easily... though I'm sure he could be pretty darn goading if he wanted to be. Saw the potential for it.

I think one of my sisters also has priest influence, and she's very good at guilt-tripping/goading, the kind where she gives you a look or tells you something you should 'do' and is usually right and you kind of hate her for it. ;) But I do like having her around. We live quite well together.

And Dave. That made me laugh quite hard last night. ;)

Priest / Re: Goading
« on: May 21, 2011, 04:27:26 AM »
Then you either thank them and love them for it, or you run far, far away.

I knew a priestly male, who first got quite angry with me for needing to 'have alone time', then pointed out my vulnerabilities and then once I was crying and angry (because some of it was true but felt very invasive) he kissed me. Then I got out of the car and ran far far away. lol.  ::)

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